"Apps of any appreciable complexity are constructed with a tremendous number of text files. As an example, just our GameSalad Creator app consists of 6,972,123 lines of code spread over 41,702 files. That’s equivalent to a book with 116,202 pages."
Good read. And as one who has done a 6 month computer programming course years ago I can testify to the truth of his statements. I did it to develop a software idea I started in a spread sheet for my business. The whole thing was a joke they tried to teach us five languages in 6 months. Laughable now but to the uninitiated......
What I learned was;
Writing any decent sized, useful and saleable piece of software is a mammoth task done by a team of people
I would need to work in the field for years just to become competent
If my goal was to get a job after doing the course it wasn't going to get me one
Enough to vaguely follow what some else wrote and a rudimentary understanding of how code is constructed but not enough to do anything meaningful.
"The best education comes from years of practice and learning, nothing less."
and
"...which is why the profession has so many autodidacts. But programmers are a natural resource. Only so many people have the will and ability to do it."
Course or no course, everyone needs to be an autodidact.
The programming landscape and the necessary resources change so quickly, that only with real passion can you find the drive to keep up, knowing that the knowledge you master today will probably be obsolete in a few months.
If you enjoy the learning experience for itself, then it may be for you, since at least a third of your time will be spent researching, learning and experimenting.
There will always be a need for people who can code. As great as GameSalad is the soft ware program still has a long way to go before it can replace coders.
I think GameSalad's strength is that it helps to introduce people to coding. To illustrate, users of GS will quickly realize is coding is for them. Honestly, I have begun the path to becoming a coder because of using GameSalad.
I will used Xcode and GS to produce my games in the future.
Big Smile Games Play Happy! Check out our other GameSalad exclusives.
@robertkdale said:
There will always be a need for people who can code.
I think not. Coders will eventually write themselves out of a job. If it takes 6,972,123 lines of code to write a relatively small program like GS imagine the size of the code base in software running on the computers of the future. Eventually there won't be enough people on the planet to write the code and it would be very laborious. Computers are going to have to do it and people will just tell the computer what they want the software to do.
At the moment I think software and more specifically the creation of software takes too many people, too much money and too long to do and this is holding up advances in computers. We just simply don't need bigger computers to run the software we can create for general use at home and in business at the moment. In general use computing we went from 8 to 16 to 32 bit relatively quickly. Getting to 64 took a lot longer because the requirement for more computing power to run the software just wasn't there. And no one is really talking about needing a 128 bit computer for general use yet. There simply isn't the mass demand for them driven by software requirements.
If you and I could sit in our home and tell our computer what program we want to create for anything imaginable that will require a very large and sophisticated piece of software and much more advanced computers to do it. At some point computers are going to have to start writing the software and eventually all of it for the human race to keep advancing.
Writing code is so inefficient, time consuming and expensive. It is no different to any of the past technological advances that wiped out vast numbers of jobs it is just further up the technology tree. They used to hire teams of people to dig trenches to lay pipes that machines took over. Everything is becoming more mechanised. I go into my local bank branch (Which I rarely do now as I can do most everything online) and it is wall to wall machines. The tellers are disappearing and they now have a concierge to help people use the machines. The list of examples is endless and will continue to grow.
Way back in the day (1998) I decided I wanted to get into Game Design. Being as society conditions everyone to go to college, I naturally wanted to find a game design college. Internet wasn't a readily accessible thing at the time where I lived, so I did what my father suggested and call around to check with game development companies. I called the 800 number on the back of my Diablo box and asked to be put through to HR. I got put through to actual Blizzard HR (again, 1998, it wasn't a massive company yet, I don't think even Brood War was out when I called in January).
The HR there told me not to go to college as college could not be cutting edge or competitively current. Colleges were by nature behind the times and therefore unusable. They could only pass along things which had long since been reduced to a plain science. If I wanted to get good enough to meet industry standards she said I needed to go straight into teaching myself, working on mods and the like, pushing the envelope and using that as my portfolio. Uncertain in myself, I pressed for a college anyways, she named one conveniently a four hour drive away, and I went there.
She was totally right. There wasn't even a course module for programming 3D engines. The programmers in my year who wanted that knowledge had to do it all themselves. The knowledge they passed on became the courses for later years.
My decision nowadays on what development tool to use, why I'm here with Game Salad, came down to simply what I felt I could learn on my own the quickest. Other tools I tried out used logic structures that seemed counter-intuitive and didn't come naturally to me. It's more costly that others, but I can at least accomplish things and retain a sense of momentum across the short evening after-work sessions I typically do.
"The most important thing I learned from the mountain of knowledge I gathered was that it doesn’t help much to gather a mountain of knowledge."
You don't need to know everything, you need to know what you need to use. Colleges, Code Academies, and the like probably spend a lot of time on things you may never use. Stuff that was added to the syllabus because the teacher liked it or the module was necessary to qualify for some kind of government funding.
If I could do it all over, I wouldn't go to college. I'd go straight into the work force, and save up to pay for some contractors. That $30k in student loan repayments could have gained a sweet amount hours from amply skilled people instead.
@robertkdale said:
There will always be a need for people who can code.
I think not. Coders will eventually write themselves out of a job. If it takes 6,972,123 lines of code to write a relatively small program like GS imagine the size of the code base in software running on the computers of the future. Eventually there won't be enough people on the planet to write the code and it would be very laborious. Computers are going to have to do it and people will just tell the computer what they want the software to do.
At the moment I think software and more specifically the creation of software takes too many people, too much money and too long to do and this is holding up advances in computers. We just simply don't need bigger computers to run the software we can create for general use at home and in business at the moment. In general use computing we went from 8 to 16 to 32 bit relatively quickly. Getting to 64 took a lot longer because the requirement for more computing power to run the software just wasn't there. And no one is really talking about needing a 128 bit computer for general use yet. There simply isn't the mass demand for them driven by software requirements.
If you and I could sit in our home and tell our computer what program we want to create for anything imaginable that will require a very large and sophisticated piece of software and much more advanced computers to do it. At some point computers are going to have to start writing the software and eventually all of it for the human race to keep advancing.
Writing code is so inefficient, time consuming and expensive. It is no different to any of the past technological advances that wiped out vast numbers of jobs it is just further up the technology tree. They used to hire teams of people to dig trenches to lay pipes that machines took over. Everything is becoming more mechanised. I go into my local bank branch (Which I rarely do now as I can do most everything online) and it is wall to wall machines. The tellers are disappearing and they now have a concierge to help people use the machines. The list of examples is endless and will continue to grow.
Eventually the Machines will just make games 24/7 without being told any ideas. they will have their own,lol.
@BBEnk said:
Eventually the Machines will just make games 24/7 without being told any ideas. they will have their own,lol.
Maybe but that would require thought which requires conscious and that only exists in living tissue. Whether it can be created in pure machinery/circuits is unknown, I think probably not. You should be ok to keep making your games, for the time being anyway
Eventually there won't be enough people on the planet to write the code and it would be very laborious. Computers are going to have to do it and people will just tell the computer what they want the software to do.
Honestly, I can foresee a future in which humans command software to create content without writing a single line of code. This would undoubtedly lead to an unprecedented creative renaissance.
Unfortunately, technology is not there yet and may not get there within our life time. Admittedly, software programs such, as GS may be the beginnings of such a renaissance. Perhaps in 30 to 40 years we may be close to having software that can write code for it's self and be truly independent of human coders. It’s possible but....
Presently, coders are still in high demand and most advanced applications and games demand advanced code knowledge and features. This coupled with GS slow feature updates have pushed me to learn coding.
In sum, I enjoy using GameSalad but I need more features than GS has to offer. Unfortunately we are limited by what features the very talented GS team can program into the GameSalad architecture.
Big Smile Games Play Happy! Check out our other GameSalad exclusives.
Braydon_SFXMember, Sous Chef, Bowlboy SidekickPosts: 9,273
@BBEnk said:
Eventually the Machines will just make games 24/7 without being told any ideas. they will have their own,lol.
@robertkdale said:
Honestly, I can foresee a future in which humans command software to create content without writing a single line of code. This would undoubtedly lead to an unprecedented creative renaissance.
Absolutely agree, I made this without writing a single line of code:
Comments
"Apps of any appreciable complexity are constructed with a tremendous number of text files. As an example, just our GameSalad Creator app consists of 6,972,123 lines of code spread over 41,702 files. That’s equivalent to a book with 116,202 pages."
Good read. And as one who has done a 6 month computer programming course years ago I can testify to the truth of his statements. I did it to develop a software idea I started in a spread sheet for my business. The whole thing was a joke they tried to teach us five languages in 6 months. Laughable now but to the uninitiated......
What I learned was;
Universal Binary Template - Universal Binary Template Instructions Rev 4 (Short) - Custom Score Display Template
"The best education comes from years of practice and learning, nothing less."
and
"...which is why the profession has so many autodidacts. But programmers are a natural resource. Only so many people have the will and ability to do it."
Course or no course, everyone needs to be an autodidact.
The programming landscape and the necessary resources change so quickly, that only with real passion can you find the drive to keep up, knowing that the knowledge you master today will probably be obsolete in a few months.
If you enjoy the learning experience for itself, then it may be for you, since at least a third of your time will be spent researching, learning and experimenting.
MESSAGING, X-PLATFORM LEADERBOARDS, OFFLINE-TIMER, ANALYTICS and BACK-END CONTROL for your GameSalad projects
www.APPFORMATIVE.com
There will always be a need for people who can code. As great as GameSalad is the soft ware program still has a long way to go before it can replace coders.
I think GameSalad's strength is that it helps to introduce people to coding. To illustrate, users of GS will quickly realize is coding is for them. Honestly, I have begun the path to becoming a coder because of using GameSalad.
I will used Xcode and GS to produce my games in the future.
Big Smile Games Play Happy!
Check out our other GameSalad exclusives.
I think not. Coders will eventually write themselves out of a job. If it takes 6,972,123 lines of code to write a relatively small program like GS imagine the size of the code base in software running on the computers of the future. Eventually there won't be enough people on the planet to write the code and it would be very laborious. Computers are going to have to do it and people will just tell the computer what they want the software to do.
At the moment I think software and more specifically the creation of software takes too many people, too much money and too long to do and this is holding up advances in computers. We just simply don't need bigger computers to run the software we can create for general use at home and in business at the moment. In general use computing we went from 8 to 16 to 32 bit relatively quickly. Getting to 64 took a lot longer because the requirement for more computing power to run the software just wasn't there. And no one is really talking about needing a 128 bit computer for general use yet. There simply isn't the mass demand for them driven by software requirements.
If you and I could sit in our home and tell our computer what program we want to create for anything imaginable that will require a very large and sophisticated piece of software and much more advanced computers to do it. At some point computers are going to have to start writing the software and eventually all of it for the human race to keep advancing.
Writing code is so inefficient, time consuming and expensive. It is no different to any of the past technological advances that wiped out vast numbers of jobs it is just further up the technology tree. They used to hire teams of people to dig trenches to lay pipes that machines took over. Everything is becoming more mechanised. I go into my local bank branch (Which I rarely do now as I can do most everything online) and it is wall to wall machines. The tellers are disappearing and they now have a concierge to help people use the machines. The list of examples is endless and will continue to grow.
Universal Binary Template - Universal Binary Template Instructions Rev 4 (Short) - Custom Score Display Template
Writing is fun!
Yes it is.
Universal Binary Template - Universal Binary Template Instructions Rev 4 (Short) - Custom Score Display Template
Way back in the day (1998) I decided I wanted to get into Game Design. Being as society conditions everyone to go to college, I naturally wanted to find a game design college. Internet wasn't a readily accessible thing at the time where I lived, so I did what my father suggested and call around to check with game development companies. I called the 800 number on the back of my Diablo box and asked to be put through to HR. I got put through to actual Blizzard HR (again, 1998, it wasn't a massive company yet, I don't think even Brood War was out when I called in January).
The HR there told me not to go to college as college could not be cutting edge or competitively current. Colleges were by nature behind the times and therefore unusable. They could only pass along things which had long since been reduced to a plain science. If I wanted to get good enough to meet industry standards she said I needed to go straight into teaching myself, working on mods and the like, pushing the envelope and using that as my portfolio. Uncertain in myself, I pressed for a college anyways, she named one conveniently a four hour drive away, and I went there.
She was totally right. There wasn't even a course module for programming 3D engines. The programmers in my year who wanted that knowledge had to do it all themselves. The knowledge they passed on became the courses for later years.
My decision nowadays on what development tool to use, why I'm here with Game Salad, came down to simply what I felt I could learn on my own the quickest. Other tools I tried out used logic structures that seemed counter-intuitive and didn't come naturally to me. It's more costly that others, but I can at least accomplish things and retain a sense of momentum across the short evening after-work sessions I typically do.
As a semi-related thing, here's an awesome article from the QA world:
http://www.satisfice.com/articles/expert_game.pdf
"The most important thing I learned from the mountain of knowledge I gathered was that it doesn’t help much to gather a mountain of knowledge."
You don't need to know everything, you need to know what you need to use. Colleges, Code Academies, and the like probably spend a lot of time on things you may never use. Stuff that was added to the syllabus because the teacher liked it or the module was necessary to qualify for some kind of government funding.
If I could do it all over, I wouldn't go to college. I'd go straight into the work force, and save up to pay for some contractors. That $30k in student loan repayments could have gained a sweet amount hours from amply skilled people instead.
Eventually the Machines will just make games 24/7 without being told any ideas. they will have their own,lol.
Maybe but that would require thought which requires conscious and that only exists in living tissue. Whether it can be created in pure machinery/circuits is unknown, I think probably not. You should be ok to keep making your games, for the time being anyway
Universal Binary Template - Universal Binary Template Instructions Rev 4 (Short) - Custom Score Display Template
@colander said
Eventually there won't be enough people on the planet to write the code and it would be very laborious. Computers are going to have to do it and people will just tell the computer what they want the software to do.
Honestly, I can foresee a future in which humans command software to create content without writing a single line of code. This would undoubtedly lead to an unprecedented creative renaissance.
Unfortunately, technology is not there yet and may not get there within our life time. Admittedly, software programs such, as GS may be the beginnings of such a renaissance. Perhaps in 30 to 40 years we may be close to having software that can write code for it's self and be truly independent of human coders. It’s possible but....
Presently, coders are still in high demand and most advanced applications and games demand advanced code knowledge and features. This coupled with GS slow feature updates have pushed me to learn coding.
In sum, I enjoy using GameSalad but I need more features than GS has to offer. Unfortunately we are limited by what features the very talented GS team can program into the GameSalad architecture.
Big Smile Games Play Happy!
Check out our other GameSalad exclusives.
Terminator FlappyBird.
My GameSalad Academy Courses! ◦ Check out my quality templates! ◦ Add me on Skype: braydon_sfx
Absolutely agree, I made this without writing a single line of code:
Arnold Schwarzenegger ?
Flappinator ... ha ha
Free Mini Games and Demo Templates